"At 17, I woke up blind." - Kevin's heartbreaking story of losing his sight as a teenager

I've got to come up with some clever ways of describing what we're doing here.

I'm very excited today for the special guest that I have with me Kevin Lo now it's interesting Kevin because I'm from the province of Alberta in Canada and we have a hockey team here, the Edmonton Oilers and they used to have A famous player and I think he was a general manager for a while and his name was Kevin low.

So when I first heard of you that my first thought was this old this is former hockey player actually.

So Jeff.

I have you know because we all Google our name every now and then and that.

Yeah so yeah that's fantastic.

So Kevin you're located where I am in Florida.

Yep.

So specifically East Central Florida in the Daytona Beach area.

Nice.

Beautiful.

Sunny warm swelteringly hot in the summer.

Yeah, as I like to call it it's a really pretty one step closer to hell in terms of heat.

That's awesome.

And so just for a bit of background on Kevin here, so Kevin is the Creator and the host of the low down with Kevin low, which is a podcast in a blog and it's actually letting you see the world through his unique point of view because Kevin is completely blind.

And it's important that we highlight, the fact that you're completely blind because as I'm learning, blindness has varying degrees.

If I can put it that way, is that correct?
Absolutely, yes.

So sometimes some people who are blind, they can, can they see shapes or Shadows or what sort of the difference here?
Yeah, of course.

Yeah.

So actually, the majority of people who say they are blind are actually, they have some degree of vision.

Generally, it's some type of light perception, maybe maybe they see certain types of Shadows or they may get some type of light.

You know, sensitivity, whereas me, I am, you know what?
They call completely blind.

Totally blind.

As I like to say I'm, you know, I'm not messing around.

I'm yeah, thank you.

Yeah, I love the fact that you you can have a sense of humor about this and I imagine that that humor has been a an important Catalyst for really coming to terms with with your life as it is.

Absolutely absolutely.

And and with all of this blind talk being said, you know for for Any of you who are watching and are thinking, why is he not looking at me or why does he keep just remember, I'm actually staring into blank space and trying to focus specifically why I started a podcast and YouTube channel.

Yeah.

And so, I mean, and I really appreciate you being willing to come on and do this live live broadcast today, because that's so because, I mean, they think it shows that you're open to this and you're willing to share your story and And this this helps other people can understand what it's like.

And so you went all in and decided to go completely blind.

Exactly right now, my question is, do you see pictures like it?
Because you went blind at 17 and we're going to get into your story a little bit here.

But do you see pictures in your head?
You see colors?
What do you visualize life in your head?
Yeah, you know, it's kind of funny because I think I think it's a common question that a lot of people wonder like what is it?
That You see, you know, when you're blind it and in a big part of my world is is is I guess, you know, visualization.

You know, when I'm sitting here at my desk, my little podcast Studio, you know, I don't feel as though, I'm just sitting in in a blank room, you know?
I mean, I'm here and my desk is in front of me, the laptops in front of me, even though I can't see it, you know?
I'm so yeah.

Very, very much visualize.

You know, even though like, you know, obviously I See color, I still like to know, especially when we start talking about clothes picking out clothes, what colors I'm wearing?
Because I still remember what color looks like.

And, yeah.

And that's something that I actually recently discovered is that a lot of people who, who become blind, don't remember what color looks like.

And so, I've been very fortunate that I do so.

So that and you know, it's so interesting because it's very hard for us to who have sight to Even imagine be like like having an idea because we just take it for granted that we have our site and we go like, you know, I I'm wearing a blue shirt and now you know, when I say that I mean there's you know how many shades of blue you might be imagining, what could be wearing right now?
You know, exactly.

Exactly.

And and I can tell you my mom and sister, who are generally, the ones who I go shopping with, they can tell you that, I am the pickiest day and blind person.

Meet.

Because because if they tell me, oh, like, this is a shirt, it's blue.

I'm like, well, what shade of blue?
And no, I don't like that shade of blue.

That's too light.

I'd rather darker blue.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Because because you remember what those colors were like, and yeah, so this we're getting a kind of an idea of present-day Kevin here and what life is like for you now.

And but I want to, I want to Dive a little bit into your story here and and again, I want to reiterate how much I appreciate your willingness to be open and to share, of course, absolutely, because in your story, you said it Kevin, you've shared how you've been able to overcome the unthinkable, which is, like becoming blind 17, and you've done this through being open, about your story going, and talking to people.

And and you like, people know, like look at the end of the day, you said, your you're just an any other 30-something trying to find your In the world and you wanting to make a difference in as many people's lives as possible along the way, which is man, that's just so awesome and so inspiring.

So maybe we, the first thing I'd like to ask you is what was it?
What was what tipped you off that something wasn't right?
So you're a teenager and something isn't, right?
And you go, okay, I need to get this checked out medically.

Yeah.

So so I had been really, really looking back on it.

I I had had had these varying symptoms, kind of from from the time I was was a young child.

And in that that started with, with failing to, I test it at kindergarten and, and that led to me, oh, you know, Kevin your needs to start wearing glasses.

So, so I started wearing glasses.

So that was one thing, which I mean not uncommon, you know?
That's something that, you know, a lot of kids go through, but then, but then you as my childhood, On, you know, I started very young.

I had had migraine headaches in elementary school and and they were caught classified as cluster migraines, okay?
Which were just super severe?
I would literally just like bang my head on the back of the couch, you know, like six years old, right?
And so that that was happening then, you know, you know, we fast-forwarding, you know, up until you know, at the time when it was on the Covered, you know at 17 years old, 17 years old, I was had not really grown.

I was only five foot three.

Yeah, I had still not gone through puberty and so you know we had all these different things.

Still headaches headaches literally every day of my life.

I had a migraine headache and okay and, you know, and all these different things and, you know, and I went to the doctor, you know, my luckily, you know, my parents, we were able like we went to my pediatrician.

And the best pediatrician where we live.

You had went to from the very beginning.

And so, you know, you trust your Physicians, they are the doctors and yeah, and he always told us, you know, it's nothing to worry about, you know, every, you know, he's just, he's just a thirsty kid or, you know, the headaches are because of this or, you know, whatever it was.

And so, yeah, there were, there were many different symptoms until finally, finally mine.

My mom and my grandmother finally really quite frankly had enough and and we switch me to go to a new doctor and not and that's when the ball got rolling.

Okay, so now this is this is I guess kind of an interesting speculation just because I'm curious.

Okay hindsight is always 20/20 which is again kind of a funny pun you know.

And it's funny as we have the ABS as we have this conversation.

I'm so I've never been so aware of speaking metaphors around vision and seeing and eyes because I'm speaking to someone who doesn't have site, you know.

Yeah, well, but you know what?
Well I will put you at rest real quick in that that is a common thing that most people when they meet me the first time they become very very subconscious of and I always tell them listen even though I'm blind I still talk like I see I still watch TV, I'm going to say see you later.

You know that Ever feel uncomfortable about you to say anything like that.

Just don't ask me to look at something on the screen and we'll be all right.

And and I you know, I just want to highlight the fact that I love how just just how open and understanding you are and how kind of you don't get offended about this and you're not you're not bitter and Frank Frankly like you know from my perspective you look like the kind of guy that I just got a big ol bear hug from and just we have we have a good time together.

So Hindsight being 20/20, you go this, this brain tumor is probably happening and I'm going to guess that it was probably pressing in your pituitary gland.

If your growth is being affected and this was happening all through like development over say 17 years.

Yeah.

Had the tumor may be been removed earlier in life, might there have been the possibility that you could have saved your site 100%.

Okay, yep, 100% said, yeah.

Yeah, that that no doubt.

Okay.

Now do you, do you ever reflect on that now and go?
We'll shoot.

I wish.

I wish I would have.

I wish I would have pursued this a little bit sooner.

You know, I have it.

My my mother my mom because she's my mom.

Yeah, has would would let it eat her alive?
And, you know, because of course, there's the guilt of there were all these different things that, that, you know, why didn't we go to a different doctor?
Why didn't we pursue this?
Why didn't you know?
And, and I always remind her, that of two things.

First, and foremost, we were the patient.

We trusted our doctor.

Yeah, you assume that your doctor knows and if he doesn't know that that doctor would send you to somebody who does know, So that's first and foremost and then second of all, is the fact that I believe in all my heart with my faith that this was in my plan, this was in God's plan for my life to happen and so therefore, you know, and I can find peace in that.

Yeah.

And that again, that's just a really, really incredible looking.

It actually speaks to the power of having having a faith in a higher power It gives you a sense of purpose and meaning.

So and man, I, my heart goes out to your mom, too.

Because I can only imagine I'm new parent.

And I'm just, I'm just starting to get a sense of what Parenthood is like.

And so I am getting an idea of what like parental love looks like and feels like and so I can only imagine because I see the bond that my son has with my wife and it's the most beautiful thing to see in to witness.

You know, like the mother-child relationship is so powerful and precious so I can only imagine what she would.

I have experienced and so in all of your own like sort of pain and struggling frustration through this, you're able to provide some comfort with her and say, you know what, like this is okay, this was meant to be.

Yeah, and my family, my family will tell you that, that really threw through it all when this happened, you know, which, which, you know, you know, none of it was expected.

Even once we found out that I had a brain tumor You know, in and I went to have it, have it removed and thankfully, it's not a type, most people think of a brain tumor think cancerous.

Luckily, this was not cancerous and, you know, and I went to have it removed and, you know, I was supposed to be back to school and like three to four weeks, you know, it was nothing.

None of this was supposed to happen and, you know, and so so my family will tell you that, that I have been the one that That has held this family together.

Yeah, because of just how I've I've handled it and I don't, you know, people can say you know, well it's you know, your personality or whatever.

Yeah, it is.

But it's God.

God, created me and I believe it, that God made me the person who can handle it.

And who would turn good into turn?
Turn this bad situation into good and give him all the glory for it.

It.

Yeah, absolutely.

And we'll talk a little bit more on that as well, but one of the things that I'm kind of curious about what went, that's why it's funny metaphor to what went through your head.

When you hear the words, you have a brain tumor.

Yeah, that was a total shock.

Because when we were sent once we change doctors, I went to this new family doctor and he he immediately, he took one look at my chart.

He you know what?
Listen to us talk.

You know, a little bit about me and he pulled my mom out into the hallway and and told her something's not, right?
And we've got to get him to a specialist immediately and The appointment with the specialist was an endocrinologist and that the endocrinologist is the one who first told us he's like, yeah, I suspect that, you know, you have a brain tumor.

Well, at that point, we never heard of anybody having a brain tumor, and so talk about like total denial, even leaving the doctor's office, even all the way up to me, having my MRI.

Like, this is so stupid, like a brain.

Tumor.

This is crazy.

And so, so, my mom was the one who actually got the phone call on her way home from work, or she was driving or something.

And, and she got the call from, from the from the doctor.

And, and he told her to pull over.

And so you knew that wasn't good.

Yeah.

And that's when he told her that, that is the MRI results.

Showed that I had a brain tumor a craniopharyngioma, Emma.

It was large had completely encased.

My pituitary gland was right in the crosshairs of my optic nerve and was pressing against my carotid artery.

And they at that moment they literally said that I had at most six months to live, if it was not removed and so that that weekend we had planned to go, we had a boat and we would drive, we would take our boat Up the Intercoastal Waterway about an hour or so North to st.

Augustine Florida.

And we would stay there at a Marina.

And so that was the plans for for that, that Friday evening.

And so my mom decided not not to tell me, she didn't want me to get upset.

So we we, we went ahead and went and once we got up to the marina and got docked and everything, it was then that that my mom.

I remember we were down in our boat.

Like a cabin here that we could sleep on it and it was there that that my mom told me the news and I don't I honestly can't remember II barely remember that part of it.

But what I do remember is just getting so upset and I remember getting off the boat as fast as I can.

I remember just running running down the dock all the way up to to Shore and I climbed up, you know, the big set of stairs that led up to the To wear like the big Marine, a house was and stuff.

And and, and I can remember standing there with my arms, on the, on the railing, looking out over the marina, gorgeous, gorgeous, Marina, there, and st.

Augustine and, and I just remember, I can, I can picture myself, just standing there and just just just, I guess just thoughts were just there were no thoughts, you know, and but you know, that that was the devastating.

In part.

But then it was the reassurance that everything was going to be okay.

You know, you know because it was you know, said, even though it's bad, you know, I we had the leading pediatric neurosurgeon, you know, right?
An hour from my home, everything was going to be fine, you know?
And so at that moment, my my personality kicked in, I I was I will who I'm going to be out of school for a month like see you suckers and, you know, and And I named my tumor.

I named my tumor bob, bob, bob the tumor.

It's so, so me and my family.

We had a huge like, going away Bob party.

You know, it's loud.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

So so you know, I we, you know, I played it up but yeah, yeah.

That initially finding out was yeah, pretty devastating.

No kidding.

Really.

In a sense because you were 17 years old and it seems like you got the World by the tail.

The world's your oyster you.

Got this huge, you know, this future ahead of you did you have a future plans after graduation for a career?
For example, I did not I did not, I hated school to be quite honest.

Yeah.

And so the thoughts of going to college we're never really anything that made me feel all that, you know inspired.

But I you know I felt like, you know until I figured out what I was going to do with life, the only thing that I was kind of To at that time was was I took a drafting and design and high school and so.

So I kind of thought about that kind of thought about being like a chiropractor, you know.

But but no, no career, you know, Ambitions at all, to be honest, like my family, they're sitting here.

If they're listening to this, they're going.

Oh Kevin.

You got to tell the truth.

And the truth was that my sister is 5 years older.

And, and Tiffany was always the, you know, You know, gung-ho like honors classes, you know, career-minded sister.

And so, you know, my goal was that I was just going to skip over the career part and go straight into retirement.

And so I had picked out down in the Florida Keys, I was going to get me a little Beachside Bungalow, Just Fish all day, you know, party all night.

And just once a month, my sister would send down to check to help support her little brother.

So that was that was kind of my plan.

That's awesome man.

I know I don't think she was in on it but yeah.

I was gonna I was definitely gonna try and see if I can make it work.

So yeah, I love that idea.

So then you go in to have the operation and probably the thing isn't on your mind.

Is this is the last time I'm going to see my family's faces.

Exactly.

So then you have the operation, you kind of waking up and when when did you, it sort of dawned on you that I can't see, you know, that that's always the million-dollar question and I always because I'm a sucker to tell a good story.

And so I wish I had a million-dollar answer but I don't yeah, because because when I came out of surgery, II don't, I don't remember any of my time in the hospital after after I wrote through the doors of the operating room table, I don't remember anything else.

Yeah, I was stayed in the hospital for four.

Gosh, I guess over two weeks.

I was in the Intensive Care Unit and I don't remember any of that time.

I don't even my memory, even coming home is very kind of spotty and vague you know, as Our as, you know, when I really start remembering but I can tell you this, I can tell you from, from the stories that my family has shared with me is is the fact that, you know, they said, I was never scared.

They said, yeah.

They said that, I never freaked out.

They said that, you know, of course, I was upset and everything, but but they said I just it was never like that moment of just oh my gosh, I can't see and start freaking out.

They said, I never, I never went through that.

Yeah, which is, which is again, really remarkable.

And I think it may be speaks to this this idea that this this is a path in life that you were intended to be on.

So then you know, you realize, you kind of come to and And, you know, you've been out of hospital for a little while and you're blind, you can't see you now, have to learn, learn how to like, live life totally differently and interact with the world totally differently.

And that's going to be an adjustment or not, just you, but if your for your family as well, all of a sudden we have, we have a blind.

So blind, son, or blind sibling.

Yes, what was that?
Like, You know, it was it was adjustment and you know, I have to give it up to my family because you know, at that at that moment for for so long, you know, I was the patient.

You know, I had so many medical issues going on, you know, as a resort you know, result of the of the surgery of now all this stuff with with you know, now taking all these medications and and be I'm blind and for myself it just it was just kind of I don't know, just things just kept falling into place and it's so I started, you know, we started you know, it seemed like all of a sudden you learned of all these new programs that you never knew existed before like a program called Hospital Homebound.

And that's where I had.

I had teachers who came to my home and they had one teacher who taught me my school Objects.

Another teacher taught me how to start reading Braille and and then you know, another teacher who was teaching me how to start using a computer with talking soft layer.

And you know, all these different things than another teacher who was teaching me Mobility using a cane and so great.

It was just all these different things that just started happening and and you know and like I said this was this was right after the start of my my junior year of high school So actually coming up this month, the 28th of this month is the 18th anniversary of my surgery.

Yeah, and so, you know, we you know, I was writing the the, you know kind of start of that school year and so so I ended up staying at home.

I never went back to school, the rest of that year, I get all at home with the teachers but you know for a kid who like I told you wasn't in the school, didn't have plans.

For college.

At the same point though, for some reason, my family will tell you that from the very beginning.

I kept saying, I want to graduate with my class.

I don't want to that was like a goal and and looking back on it.

Now, I think, how, like ironic in strange, that was like, why, why was that so important to me?
Yeah, and yeah, you know, I fought through all the short-term memory loss that I suffered for like Six months, following surgery you know all these different medical issues in just adjusting.

Like I said just adjusting to this new world to the fact that I caught up with my schoolwork.

I did what I had to that.

I was able to start back to school for the start of my senior year and I only I went back to school just for like one class a day and then I did the rest at home with the teachers, but it gave me an opportunity to Quote unquote.

Be a part of my senior year.

Yeah.

And you know I ultimately graduated with my class which was huge for me.

Yeah, you know but it was the you know, the whole, you know, adjusting to this new world it just we I compare it to the fact that we just as a family we're going through the motions.

Yeah, you know and and just surviving really really that bad.

That's kind of how you saw is.

Just literally surviving.

Yeah, because each member of your family, but is it would be affected by a differently.

But, I mean, it sounds like you have, like, a really like a supportive and a loving family, who cares about you?
How many siblings do you have?
I just have, I just have one.

Just have my sister, but then, yeah, my family, my family is, is literally everything for me.

And, and that's what I've said.

Like, my my parents, they divorced.

When I was really young, like, I guess, like first, Second grade, my parents divorced, but what's so awesome about my family is a fact that when it matters you would never know that there was a division and families.

Because at the hospital at the hospital, the waiting room was filled with my entire family meeting my dad's side.

My mom side all joined together as one family.

And, and I really, I really believe that that this Meaning to me really kind of brought brought these to, you know, family separated by divorce, you know, closer, you know, back bonded together.

You know, you know, and I think a really great way yeah, which is fantastic.

I wanted to ask you about, you know, when you're, when you're blind.

Okay, you now have to learn, you have to learn how to move again because all of a sudden, one of the ways that we sort of sense our position in space is taken away, that that Depth perception is taken away.

So, all of a sudden like walking, it's like, you have to relearn walking in a totally different way.

Exactly, exactly.

Yeah.

And that's where that's where I got, you know, I learned, you know, to use a cane and so, so it's, you know, the typically, you know, blind people.

It's the white.

It's a white cane.

Yes, it's anywhere from like the height, you know, if you're standing upright, it comes anywhere to from like your chest up to mine.

Comes up to about my mouth.

Okay, the height of the cane and so truly, you know, you know, they're at the beginning, you know, is basically, you know, your eyes, quote unquote.

See only, you know what you're touching or what the tip of your cane touches.

Okay?
Yeah, yeah.

That's an interesting way of thinking about it that your eye sees, what, what the cane touches.

And exactly.

Yeah, because when you said learning to walk with a cane and a Didn't first occurred to me, of course at the blind, the blind person is gain, which is white and some of these days, like a red stripe on it.

Yeah, I was thinking like, a cane to keep your balance, but were you able to to walk and keep your balance?
I was yes, yeah, yeah.

Okay, job.

So I don't have any issues with that.

So now, okay, so yeah, because, yeah, that's what this, this type of Cain is they call, you know, like a Mobility Cane versus like a support Canaan.

So yeah, so as I, as I walk, it is outstretched in front.

Of me you know feeling you know the ground in front of me.

Yep.

Do you have a guide dog?
I don't know.

My family.

All wanted me to get a guide dog.

So bad.

Of course this day.

They still want me to and I've never had any interest.

Yeah.

Well because I just think, you know, like being a guide dog is kind of the most noble calling for an animal.

You think will would act what you're doing and you know, they're well-trained and so on.

So I can imagine they would all want It because it would be a very gentle natured, very intelligent, intelligent dog, and would probably get spoiled horribly.

Exactly, exactly.

So then you wanted to go back to high school again after you after your surgery here and recovery and so on.

Did people treat you differently?
I mean, I imagine they would but like how was it different all of a sudden?
Yeah, you know it's I had a huge group of friends growing up and not, not any like best friends, you know, but, but, you know, a huge group of acquaintances.

And so, so, you know what high school, you know, during, you know, in between classes, you know, it was a huge group of us and, you know, all of us would pile and each other's cars on lunch break, you know, going to going off campus to lunch and stuff.

So, you know, one would think that You know, I had all these friends who would be there for me, but at the same point and and I say this because in a I'll preface this by saying that I recognize now that we were all just kids.

Yes.

Yeah.

It's so I don't hold any hard feelings, you know, to any of them but the fact was, you know, it was too.

It was two different, it was too upset.

For them, you know, to, to approach me and and so, but all, except for four friends, I had four friends.

It was my friend, Brandon, my friend Mindy and then, my friend friends, Michael and Jessica, the four of them literally were there with me from from the very beginning and, and are still, you know, friends of mine today.

And, and so.

So, So you're they were amazing but yeah.

But you know in general going back to school, you know it was it was good but it was it was also hard, you know, at the same time just just kind of like during that whole time you know, my I would go a lot of times mostly with with my buddy brand and he would you know, pick me up and you know, I would go with him and maybe some other guys, you know, to dinner or something and it is much as I enjoyed it.

It was It was always so hard because I would always come home and I would every time I'd come home and just lay in bed and cry, because as much as I enjoyed it it was just another was kind of a reminder of what happened to me.

Right?
The way I kind of like that.

You'd lost exactly exactly.

Yeah.

But I do though I give I give those four friends so much credit for the fact that we were all just Kids.

They were living their own lives yet yet, you know, they, they were awesome enough to put aside the uncomfortableness, you know, and we're still my friend.

And that's something that today when I speak to two classes, like I'll speak to Elementary and Middle School classes and basically just showing off my blind skills.

Make my make myself happy like somebody superhero, you know.

Yeah, yeah.

I also try to give them some life lessons.

So, and that's one of the big ones is.

I always tell them the story of these friends and and I say because, you know, all of us in life, you know, especially kids school can be tough, especially for a kid who is different, who maybe has a disability or whatever.

And in the fact is they're all just we're all just people just trying to make it in this life and you know, we all just want to fit in, you know.

Yeah stuff.

And so So yeah, so I for those who, you know, were awesome with that was was phenomenal and you know, in the high school, it went good.

I had you know some very funny times they set me up with an aide, okay?
So to go to class with me, that was a total joke.

Is it obviously like we don't get like like a ton of people volunteering to be an aid for the blind people I guess.

Because yes, the first of they set me, Up with super nice and friendly.

But she was at worse Health than I was, she would, she would fall asleep during class and so I'd be sitting there in my teachers would say, you know, excuse me, excuse me, because she's over there snoring and all the kids laughing.

And meanwhile me like, I would just get so annoyed with it.

I would just not wake her up and leave her be.

It's my life's.

Yeah, exactly.

So so yeah, it was It definitely had its own challenges.

Yes yeah.

So then I want to ask a couple difficult questions here.

Of course one did you get bullied after losing your sight?
I did not.

No you're not.

And that's that is phenomenal and I think probably it was very helpful at you.

I mean you already already have a big personality I can just see it.

Like you're fun to be around.

Yeah and then another really difficult question.

Did you ever contemplate suicide?
Did that ever cross your mind?
Making that your life has been taken away from you.

I will tell you that I would tell you that becoming blind was was something that I would never work wish on my worst enemy because it has literally been at times absolute torture and and there have been so many nights over these past 18 years that I literally have just buried my face in my pillow, sobbing crying begging Going to God and, you know, to in and just angry, even at God for doing this to me and in, but during those times, I would, I would always pray and I would, I would beg God to give me the strength to do it.

Let me be able to take my own life.

and I'll tell you, I never even got any further than that, because every time I thought to my family, And I thought there's no way that I could leave them.

Yeah.

And so that's what I always tell people that I actually had come up with an equation back back, then.

When all of that was happening, I came up with an equation for myself and that was Faith plus family equals a life worth living.

Yeah, and I always tell everybody that that my faith is how I did it or how I didn't do it.

My faith in my family is why I did it.

Yeah, man.

Has those two things together made made this life, even as difficult and it absolutely horrible as it was it still made it worth living.

And I was like, I just want to let that sink in for a minute.

That's so so powerful and research shows that those who have faith in a higher power or a higher being and a higher purpose.

Generally speaking will Way better mental health, better quality of life, because it allows that allows us to create a sense of purpose and meaning for life that otherwise might seem meaningless.

And so, you know, I you're able to say that like and here's the other thing I think people who would be Maybe Christian and serving God and things like that, they might, they might think what this and think.

Well, why did why did God do this and somehow?
Or maybe there's this misconception out there that if somebody does become a Christian or is a Christian that they're expecting God to make their life easy and and what would you say to people who feel that way about Christianity that somehow serving God, supposed to make your life easy?
I'll tell you that the moment you become a Christian, you better watch out because I was probably going to get a little bit more difficult.

And here's what I have to say about that, is because it does seem like from my perspective, that sometimes, it seems like those who, who aren't Christians, or maybe even their Christian, but maybe, maybe they don't really walk in that face.

So much it seems like their life is great.

It's easy.

They don't, they don't face troubles and here's how I personally have come to wrap my head around.

That is the fact that, you know, God knows that, they can't handle it, we can and, you know, and, and, and so that's how you know, I've had the, you know, kind of come to grasp with that is.

I'm like, yeah, you may think there's you're all great wonderful but God knows they're weak, you know, because they don't have him.

But, you know, on the other token to though is, you know, God tells us, you know, in this world we will have have you no problems, you know, because if this life was so perfect, then you know, what would Heaven be?
Yeah, and, you know, it's interesting to think about even even in that perspective.

I think of two things.

One, I've never met a remarkable person who had an easy life.

Yeah, so, it's Sure to want its natural part of, maybe a primal part of Being Human to want to have an easy life.

I understand that we're wired to try and avoid pain and discomfort.

And here, in one sense you could say, you're a bit of a prisoner because a part of like, living life has been taken away from you.

Yeah.

But on the other hand, I feel like because I've been through a number of hard experiences in my life as well.

And the way that I kind of make sense of it is, right?
I couldn't handle them by myself.

I couldn't exactly.

And this is how I see it.

That I had to be brought to the end of myself to actually, genuinely be able to have faith in God.

Exactly.

Exactly.

It's true because if I could just do it all myself, like, what's the point?
Yeah, exactly.

So, you know, and it's funny because I heard they were talking about my faith publicly actually.

I'm not, it's not that I'm ashamed of it, but it's just generally speaking.

I'm like, I generally don't talk about Must somebody really wants to know about it.

But the truth is I couldn't have got through some of the experiences I've been through in my own like abilities, basically.

Exactly because I was, you know, what do I have left?
When I nearly died and went through trauma.

What do I have left?
When I lost all of my life savings.

Like I've lost everything in my past and brought and then not even knowing what to do after that.

And so I think in one sense, I can enter into this feeling of loss, like oh my gosh, the future that I thought I was going to have was taken away from you.

What's What's the point of all of this?
But because of what you've know and believe you are able to turn this into something extremely meaningful.

So yeah.

Is there?
So then is there is there anything that you're I don't know, afraid of or do you think going through this experience?
And I don't think I mean I think Fearless is kind of a myth.

But I mean, do you think going through this experience has really taken away.

A lot of fears that you might otherwise have been crippled with in life.

You know, I'll tell you, I'll be honest in terms of fears.

The only the only true like fears that I have are losing my family.

Yeah.

Because because my family is so much to me.

Yeah.

You know, that that is truly, truly, you know.

And want to talk about fears, that that's truly the one and only true fear that I have.

Yeah.

Is is I can't I can't imagine I can't let my mind even go there to imagine walking through this life, without them.

Yeah, you know.

But you know, at the same token I have to look back on my past to help remind me of what God is capable of read.

The fact is look what I've been through.

Look what he brought me through and in my I will continue to face challenges hard times, the unthinkable and he will continue to bring me through it just like he has.

Yeah.

So then I wanted to ask about you mentioned, the four friends that really stuck with you in high school.

Are you still friends with them to this day, or do you still have the?
Yeah I do.

Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah it and it's awesome because you know they they they all have kids and stuff now and and you know and Especially my one friend Mindy, she she's moved away.

She you know, her her husband there, you know, is in the service.

And so they have lived all over but you know, her kids are just your they're amazing.

And so I get to, you know, just be best friends with her and in her kids and it's yeah, it's awesome.

So you're like Uncle Kevin to them.

Exactly.

Exactly.

Yeah.

So then you know sounds like, you know, actually despite you being the one with this disability that you Being a support for a lot of people, exactly.

Yeah, definitely definitely.

I truly am I, I feel like that is, you know, Yeah, I say that you know when God when God selected me to have this happen to me and you know he knew that that those first 17 years of my life were, we're all in preparation for what was to come.

And and I believe that he made me the man that I am today because he knew that he knew that I could take this quote disability and turn it into this amazing.

Ability to connect with people, you know, on a deeper level and I feel like you know, that's the case with strangers.

You know, that I interviewed for the first time ever on my podcast or it's my family who just you know I'm just to be an awesome person to talk to, you know.

And you know and I sometimes have thought like what I be that same man, if this hadn't happened to me.

Yeah, I don't know.

It's so I'm you know and so when I think of it like that I mean I'm so grateful truly grateful for for the trauma that I have gone through because it has made me into the person that I am.

And that's such an interesting thing to say because I've said something very similar that I'm grateful for the hard experiences, I've gone through and I wouldn't ask for them again.

Like if I'm being totally unacceptable, I wouldn't ask for them again but I am grateful because one because I got through it.

Yeah, but because it's shaped me into who I am now.

Now, and I would not be who I am now.

If I hadn't gone through those experiences of it, hadn't been brought to the end of myself, if I'd had an easy life and so, who do you turn to for support?
Then my support system is, it's probably probably three people for support and that that's my grandmother had called Nana.

Yeah.

My then, my mom who's basically like my best friend and then my sister, those, those three, those three are.

Definitely my my support, those are the three, who, you know, I don't, I don't a lot of people don't realize, you know, the bad days when I when I have those bad days which thank goodness, they don't come nearly as often as they used to.

But you know those are the three people who truly see me on the worst of days and you know, the right there.

They are my support.

Exactly.

Yeah.

Now you were able to do something.

You're really pretty awesome.

Not only like do you run a podcast and you're very active because I think none of us who are, who are visually impaired.

Like we don't, we don't realize how many cool things you can still do and what technology is really facilitated.

So you, you run a business as like a travel agent.

Exactly.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Yep.

I started a home-based travel agency back in January of 2013.

So yeah.

Yeah.

I've been, you know, because that all kind of got started because you know, traveling is something that that I love to do.

You know all growing up, you know, it was one of the again one of those blessings that God gave me was who's getting to do and see so much in those first 17 years of life and, you know, from snow skiing to going, you know, snorkeling in surfing and, you know, all these different things.

And so, you know, for myself Self, you know, traveling and stuff.

That is always been a joy than even after becoming blind because, you know, as I tell people, you know, I just, I see the world in a new way instead of, instead of seeing a destination based on what my eyes, see, I see it based on you know what the people are like what the sounds are like you know, the feel of the air, you know, it all paints.

This picture for me of what you know a destination is I don't need I say to see how beautiful it is and so is so, you know.

Yeah.

That's what that's what kind of led me to get into travel and it's do some different things and, you know, I was at a point in my life did we're here.

I really didn't know what to do and so I, you know, just the pieces kind of fell into place and so yeah, I started up my own agency and, you know, have been doing that, you know, last year with the pandemic that took a devastating blow to my travel agency But but that below that it took you know, it gave me the downtime to discover this new passion that I absolutely love and you know that's podcasting.

Yeah.

And and really connecting with people and sharing your story and and not only that again because I really you know, I see your you as quite a quite a selfless individual here and so you you have this podcast and you share your story but with not only that you share other people's stories as well.

Because you don't necessary want all of the spotlight to be on you.

But just really your life shows people there is life after disability.

There is life after trauma, there is life after you know a future that you thought you might have had is taken away from you and you said and I'd like to just shine a light on this a little bit.

You said you see, you know, you can't see you're completely blind, but you've learned to see in a different way you see, and what do you mean by that?
Is is kind of kind of, you know, just just what I was saying in the fact that, you know, I feel like I feel like when we see we get so wrapped up in sight, in the truth is site is only one of our senses.

Yes.

And and yet so many times, you know, it's when you ask somebody about an experience they've had they're going to tell you what it looked like.

Oh my gosh you should have saw, you know.

Oh the Palm trees.

They were so beautiful.

You know, well if you ask him about well well what you know what about the saying?
Like how did it feel in between your toes, right?
Oh well I didn't pay attention to that or I didn't take my shoes off or, you know, or or what about the people, you know, because that's what like traveling for me.

The people, the people are what, you know, paint a picture of what a place is, you know.

And yeah, it's so, you know, that's, you know, that's what I mean.

Is the fact that That we have all these other senses which which I am - doubt on site.

Plus.

Now I lost my smile when I what I from the same surgery that I lost my eyesight from so hey, I'm down to only three senses.

Yeah, but but, you know, but so I have that.

But then you also, you know, is the fact that, you know, Together our senses, you know, combined, with with our brain, we can develop nuisances like, I developed, you know, the skill of echolocation.

No kidding.

Yeah.

It's so I actually had started kind of doing it without even knowing what it was at the same time that I learned about this guy named Brian Bush.

Way out in Los Angeles, California.

Yeah, and this was back in 2017.

And so, Long story short, I end up realizing finding out that he at the time was working as an instructor with, with an organization teaching people all over the world, how to use echolocation.

And so, I literally went out to California to Los Angeles.

My mom and sister for a week and I trained one-on-one with this guy, Brian.

And so, literally now I can tell you that, you know, when I was talking earlier Out, you know, not feeling like, you know, kind of visualizing stuff in the room.

Well, the Echolocation takes that a step further because now, I have trained the visual cortex of my brain to see through sound see through Echo.

And so, that's the truly.

Now, you know, like a real-life Daredevil.

Exactly, that's, that's exactly what the pastor at my church.

As always, when I did the training and with out there and stuff, in my church, should raise money for me.

And all that.

And that's what he was.

So excited always call me.

The, the resident Daredevil, isn't that in the building?
You know, but, but yeah, it's that's what you know, is just that truly changed my life because it didn't even more.

So, now what I said earlier about only being able to see what, you know, my hand touches her my cane touches.

Well, now I can see all the objects around me, you know, it's obviously in a For it way.

It's not like we're just with with your site, but, you know, literally you form These acoustic images.

So so I can, you know, walk up.

You know what I like in a parking lot?
I can walk up and see, oh, there's a car right there, by in.

And I do a sharp little tongue, click a little click, with my tongue against the roof of your mouth and it emits this little little snap and you pick up on the Echo and uniforms this acoustic image and it's incredible.

Yeah.

So This is this is crazy because I mean I love this but it shows us the power of the brain like my mind is actually going to overdrive's.

And thing like, oh my gosh, could I develop echolocation as well?
You did?
No.

Could I oh you got?
Yes.

Yes.

That you literally and that's what I've actually read some studies and stuff where a person had trained himself to do it by, you know, he would blindfold himself and do these different activities and stuff in Yes, you truly can train yourself and but, but the science.

What's kind of cool is literally.

If you didn't like an MRI of of a blind person who doesn't use echolocation, if you did an MRI of their brain, the visual cortex would be, would be black.

Okay?
Let's run go activity.

If you do an MRI of a blind person who uses echolocation, it's lit up like somebody who can see That that is so cool.

So yeah now I'm like, oh my gosh, I want to develop Daredevil superpower.

Like obviously we don't even like I think because we have something like site, we don't tap into these other areas of our brain.

And so we would just think it's not possible and yet we're only beginning to discover what what the brain can do and how powerful it can be.

So actually you might do mind like giving an example of.

So if you want to do echolocation, what kind of sound you make?
so my mouth is super dry right now that like so so it's like a sharp little, like a Just a little click of the tongue or I mean you can even just do a snap of my finger, okay?
Anything.

But the tongue click in particular works, perfect.

Because I can control how loud it is.

And so, so if I'm you know, up close and I'm trying to locate an object say on my desktop and you know, on my desk and I'm not wanting to just reach out, you know, I could do a do a very soft little, click of the Tongue versus if I'm outside, I'm going to do a much louder, click on my tongue and and the fact that it's right in between your ears.

And so, yeah, it's centrally located for the echo to them.

Bounce, right back at you.

So then I'm thinking you can communicate with whales to right back.

Exactly.

So, something like that.

I remember doing an experiment where I was at the girl, I was dating at the time.

We each decided we're going to spend Our blindfolded like fully blindfolded.

It was kind of an experiment in trust, but we wanted to see what is actually like.

And what I can tell you is, first of all, it's a really disconcerting feeling to like, have your vision taken away in the first, my first impulse was wanting to remove the blindfold, be able to see again because there's so much trust that we needed to have.

But as I started walking around, I noticed every other sense becoming much more attuned.

So I would feel like the crunch of a branch under under my foot.

In a way I hadn't felt before and I would hear it differently.

And I would listen to sounds and sort of, if someone else was around us, could kind of gauge them coming closer, and they didn't know we're doing, you know, of course.

But like the other senses became much more acutely developed, which is really interesting.

And I imagine this has been your experience as well.

Absolutely, absolutely.

Have you ever done a dining in the dark experience?
I have not.

But now I want you to have you heard of it?
No.

No.

No.

I'm like now I want Because and you're going to, I'm going to let you share about this.

But I just want to say one of the things that I talked about.

I think that is really, really important because I work to help people heal their relationship with food.

And yeah, part of it is actually being able to experience food more fully.

So instead of feeling guilty and eating it as fast as possible because you want it.

But you feel so guilty about eating it, it's about being present with it and experiencing everything it has to offer from like the The Taste, the smell like each mouthful you're sensing into the texture and you're A much more present with a bite of food than you ever would before and because of that, you naturally, eat a little bit less and eat a bit slower, but you get more enjoyment out of eating and so I only imagine eating in the dark.

Oh, my gosh.

Yeah.

So so we there have been, we have done several dining in the dark events that have been charity event fundraising events for for some of the local organizations like center for the visually impaired, you know who dudes do stuff to help the people who are blind or visually impaired and so so that Has been a lot of fun because I've gotten to attend those with my family.

Yeah.

And so they literally when they when they take you into the room, they you enter, they call it like there.

I don't know what their blackout room first.

And so they take, you know, table by table of people.

Because generally, it's always like a really big event, you know?
Yes.

Yeah.

And so they take you into a room, they shut the door behind you.

Once that door is fully shot, then they open the door into the dining room.

Umm, so yeah.

No light comes into the dining room.

Okay.

And so they did lead everybody and they have everybody lie like in a conga line.

And and they have the, the waiters have always been here where I live at these events have been like volunteer, deputy sheriff's, who are wearing night vision?
Goggles?
Okay.

Okay, it's so those are the waiters and so they lead everybody to the table.

Well, I have gotten such a kick out of it because My family are like total just animals, trying to eat their food because do the Vince, I mean, it's set up like the tables are set like super fancy.

Like you're going to like a fancy like banquet dinner.

So you got the multiple pieces, you know, multiple forks and spoons and you got you got the wine glass and the water goblet and, you know, all of this stuff in.

So, anyways, like I can't remember what one year my dad.

He was sitting next to me.

And and they don't they don't even tell you what you're eating.

And so that's very, that's very interesting because again it kind of shows you how kind of terrible our senses are on their own because so many people, you know, eating the food.

Don't even would think it's one thing to then afterwards.

They tell you what you've eaten, didn't realize it was something different.

Now that out really, So you don't tell them what you're eating.

You eat it.

And they go like well I mean it tasted good but you don't tell so you could because like last night I made chicken gizzard, soup.

For example.

Okay.

Okay.

And because I'm trying to move into more nose-to-tail eating where I learned to eat other parts of the animal besides muscle meat.

And if you didn't, if I didn't know, like what I was eating, I would have thought I was eating beef, like little little chunks of beef.

Yeah, that's that's how it comes out.

I would not have thought I was eating chicken, but exactly, you know, The first time I was eating them, I noticed, I felt a little bit of a sense of repulsion, even though it's like, you know, it actually tastes good, I enjoy the girls rub.

It really is like beef, but there was still a sense of repulsion because I was like, this is a chicken gizzard.

This is not say, chicken breast, exactly, but if I didn't know that, that was what I was eating, I would had no issue with it.

Of course, of course it's so, so but it was just so funny.

And that was something that my family has always said that they've always thought so amazing about me is the fact that I've never had any issues.

After you losing my sight as far as being messy, a Messy eater anything.

And I've always said, I'm like, I don't understand guys like it's not difficult to put something into your mouth without singing it, but take them to dining in the dark and you realize like now they're trying to like cut up their food trying to stab a bite.

You know, I used to spank and now put it in their mouth and oh my gosh, I get such joy out of doing those experiences with my family.

But, you know, you have some who at the end are like super impressed with themselves.

And I'm like, whoo.

Yeah, man.

I did so good.

I didn't make a mess and then you have the other ones who like my dad, who he, finally, I remember that one night.

He's like I'm just done.

He's like, I'm just I'm, he's like, I'm just giving up.

He said, he's like I'm so frustrated, I can only imagine, but it's actually a very interesting thinking about that because they would actually get a taste of kind of your experience.

For example, where You have site the next day you don't exactly.

Exactly.

You know, versus gradual deterioration over time.

Yep, exactly.

So yeah.

So those are, those are definitely cool.

Definitely.

If you ever hear of here of that happening in your area or anything definitely recommend giving that a try.

Yeah, that's awesome.

So you have superpowers with echolocation kind of like Daredevil.

Yeah yeah you can eat perfectly well in the dark I think I think your other suit Her power is just your very genuine positivity, like, you know, we've never met in person but I just I know the first time we meet, if we get a chance of meeting is there's this going to be a great big bear hug like exactly because you're just naturally a warm person who people want to be around.

So kind of my last question for you is can you can you sense people's energy or or something like that?
Is there something, if someone walks into a room, can you get a sense that a someone walked in the room and be?
Maybe their state of being or mind?
Is it?
Is that nothing?
Oh yeah.

I mean.

Super, I mean whether or not, you know, like knowing if they walk in the room or not, you know, I'm not going to give myself like that kind of scared, you know, without me, like, hearing them, I just pick up on there being your something.

Uh, I mean, I'm pretty in tune.

It be kind of hard for somebody to slip by me, without me hearing them, you know, their footsteps or something.

But we heard something break into your house.

Exactly, exactly.

Yes.

And so, um, you know, but but no, I'm super in tune to Apple's just energy.

That is something that I'm very, very in tune with something that that somebody who I can, I can pick up on it, you know, whether even it's very easy most time for me to realize right off the bat.

Is this person nervous about meeting me?
You know, saying the wrong thing, I can pick up on that or or just like you said, you, I don't think it's something that I ever really paid as much attention to is when I can see you know.

As now when I can't of just the the energy that each of us put off, you know and and there's certain people who you meet and you talk to it like you feel good like you walk away and you just feel happy and uplifting and then there's other people who you just feel like icky you know what I mean?
And so so yeah.

I'm very in tune to that and that's that's so fascinating because it's I think it's a part that some people would rather pretend didn't exist or feel weirded out by it or Are afraid to acknowledge it, but I'm like, yeah, that there is something there.

You can feel it when, you know, a positive person walks into a room or negative person walks in a room, you can feel it when you've spent time in, someone's presence.

Do you feel recharged or do you feel, you know, D energized.

And, you know, I think having this conversation, like I feel recharged having this conversation.

And I can't tell you how excited I am about this whole echolocation thing.

I'm like, oh my gosh, it never occurred to me, that would be a thing and yet, here it is.

So now, I want to learn echolocation, exactly, yeah, Cool.

So yeah, it could definitely be something to impress some friends with, you know, so do you?
Yeah.

Do you have, do you have any other tricks up your sleeve that I didn't?
I didn't learn about today?
Oh well, I don't think so.

I mean already you have some pretty awesome like I'm like, okay cool.

There's got to be more here.

Yeah, I don't know.

I mean I make a pretty mean cup of coffee in the morning.

Yeah.

Like that is impressive though.

It was cool.

If he did like a latte.

Heart.

Yeah, well, that's one of the things I started to say, you know, talking about the dining of the dark event.

You know, is is I always tell the people, you know, who I'm with on Mike.

Mike, you know, you guys are so impressed with Mike, you should have been at my house for breakfast and lunch, you know, I was dining in the dark and I had to cook the food, you know?
That's awesome.

Yeah.

So.

Well Kevin.

It's been an absolute pleasure.

I love that.

You're so open with your story, clear.

Is not gonna be the last time we talked together because I think we've formed a friendship and I've loved it.

If people want to connect with you because like man, I love this guy's store.

I just want to know more, where do they connect with you?
Yeah, so you can find me so the name of my podcast and brand is called the low down with Kevin Lo and so that is literally the name of my website is just literally the low down with Kevin Lo.com and then that's the same same handle for, I'm on Instagram and Facebook.

Is, you know, just both of those are at the low down with Kevin, oh, also.

So please be sure.

You know, you're more than welcome to, you know, go on my website, you know, send me an email from there or go on Instagram or Facebook.

Send me a message, always glad to help always got that, you know, help people out.

You know, I'm part of on Facebook is, is got some different groups support groups for people who are blind or visually impaired.

And and you know that that's been like a big really big like joy for me is, is Being able to kind of give back to people, who are going through stuff, who you know, who are, you know, maybe at the the start of the road that, you know, I've been traveling down for now, 18 years and then I can help them and you know, always always there.

Are you said always there just to help somebody out make them laugh or just give them somebody to listen to.

So that's amazing.

Well, thank you again, so much, Kevin, thank you for sharing your story.

It's been an absolute pleasure, and we're going to wrap up the live broadcast here.

X everybody for hanging a hope you enjoyed it.

I'm doing this mobile times a week and in fact I do have a live broadcast later today with another very very entrenched interesting gentleman.

So stay tuned for that one coming soon.

Thanks again.